posted on #1
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This is a very tricky subject but the forum post about competition got me thinking. Now, I confess I really dont understand human behaviour, so perhaps people here could enlighten me. Whenever someone I know does anything creative, I always show support. Yet in my life most of my family, friends and partners have not supported me but behave as if they are jealous. I do love what I do and I work hard at it..I would say I have more enthusiasm than confidence..but this seems to annoy people. My ex never once asked me to play a song in the 10 years we were together. I feel like my music is some kind of dirty little secret I keep so others dont feel threaten.
posted on #2
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I found this interesting as I have has the same experience with family and friends, no real interest in my music never attended any of my shows or gave words of encouragement. never considered it jealousy but I think that may be it. I enjoy your music Tu :)
posted on #3
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You make beautiful music and I appreciate it like many people here. Not everybody like what I do or what you do. It is normal. Who cares. We have fun doing what we like to do and we do our best. The rest is not important.

About support, I see all the music you create and I also see lots of positive comments. Be positive yourself my friend. We are a community of creators and you are part of it.

And don't care about people who are not positive about you or what you do. You are unique and full of talent. I am old enough to understand that some people are unhappy and naughty. I try to stay away from them.
Take care and sing a song. This is what you do best.
posted on #4
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Jealousy is the biggest compliment you can get. You need to work hard for it.

I am proud of any enemy. And if it is a really talented guy I am even prouder.

Well, I see the world fulfilled with people who give support and encouragement. I understand the secret and the difference between the two groups. You can be proud of your songs. You are a talented songwriter for sure. This is evident.
posted on #5
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Thankyou so much for your kind and thoughtful comments and yes I love Wikiloops because it is a chance to escape all the 'naughty' people! So much support and love here. If only the whole world was like Wikiloops!
posted on #6
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I have found that people actually feel threatened by the creative types. Keep shining bright Tu. Don't let them kill who you really are. Know your own worth...and feck 'em! ;)
posted on #7
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Interesting thoughts Tu. And thinking about it, yes, I'm also pretty much alone in my direct surrounding. Meaning there isn't much interest from my family (sometimes they listen, but none seems to want to participate), and colleagues don't even comment on what I'm doing. Is that jealousy? I don't know. But there's lots of support around here, and it surely feels nice. I was welcomed pretty much with open arms, is my impression - and I'm grateful for that.
posted on #8
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I didn't mean to start a debate on this. But it is an interesting one!

Part of the problem, for me, is the word 'jealousy'. The word 'jealous', in my opinion, implies envy and, to a lesser extent, a kind of malevolence - an intent if you will. I think many others may see it that way.

Jealousy can take many forms of course but I often think of it, in this context, as also a deep down resentment-yet-acceptance of one's own failures and inadequacies that one often doesn't want to admit to!

Music, as mentioned, is a great example. To be be jealous of a musician's talents is, in reality, to admit that perhaps one is not prepared to work equally as hard at something - it's a realisation. The problem is, music is so ubiquitous that many non-musicians do not understand or appreciate what it takes to become fluent in an instrument. Furthermore, I've known many to fail to appreciate the sheer dedication and love required to get good - they almost cannot understand doing something for the love of it. The attitude of 'it doesn't make money so why do you do it?' I've heard too many times in my life. And there's no explaining it to some people. Just move on.

Also, there's a connection when a group of people get down and lock into a song. 'Outsiders' don't like this - especially partners. More than once have I been in arguments with partners because I've 'looked at the singer funny'... Jealousy right there: as if I have some emotional connection they can't have.

Conversely, jealousy can be constructive if you decide to channel it towards a good thing. There are players on here I'm so impressed by, so longing of their skill, control and judgement that, yes, I'm technically jealous. But I channel that to drive me forward, to improve, to set new goals.

Long and short: there's no explaining that feeling a song coming together gives unless you're part of it - even when the musicians are thousands of miles apart. Some people cannot or will not want to understand that. Just remember that it's their problem, not yours, and no amount of explaining it will make a jot of difference.

Just don't ever let it spoil your day or your fun...
Edited by mpointon on April 18 2018 14:18
posted on #9
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Hahaha out of this interesting thread, I had an English "lesson" now, googling "the difference between envy and jealousy" <3
posted on #10
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Lol. Just looked up the difference. Envy is to covet what someone has, jealousy is the emotional fear that something you have will be taken away. So I clearly took the 'envy' definition rather than jealousy. But I kind of touched on both... Ooops.
posted on #11
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There's another issue with family, which I don't think is envy or jealousy. If just your partner it's what's sometimes called "music widow". There's also that familiarity of having heard it all with practice or someone continually playing their favorite tunes, or just their style. My Father was a professional musician (very successful) but had a health issue and had to quit. He never gave up music, but was very stuck in his era. I honestly didn't want to continually hear the same stuff and it didn't appeal. No jealousy or envy there. When he would ask us children (there were five of us) to sing or otherwise entertain his guests while he played (keys) that was a major cringe factor. I really didn't enjoy this at all and it could have easily stopped me from doing anything further in music. It wasn't collaborative at all, more like being a dancing singing monkey.

The music widow isn't necessarily jealous of the talent/ability, but could just be resentful of the time that's given to music and not've got another love.

So, from my perspective/experience not all is jealousy or envy, there is also tedium with hearing the same thing...taking up other's listening space; and resentment for the time spent which doesn't include your partner.
posted on #12
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I don't think jealousy is the right word here.
I live with mother-in-law (opera singer)
wife (soul singer/dancer)
daughter (singer)
dad was a (skiffle guitarist)
....and none of these people ever takes any interest in what any of the others have or is doing musically! I don't think its jealousy... its like Wade said, they're just sick of hearing the others style or practice, and/or are so involved with their own creations that its taken for granted that everyone else is with theirs. so they just get on with their thing and I get on with biggy. :)

ps ...nice to know you're ok Wade...havnt heard from you for a while, and was beginning to get worried about you.
he who works with his hands, is a labourer
he who works with his hands and his head, is a craftsman
he who works with his hands, his head, and his heart, is an artist.....(I just dont work)
posted on #13
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Thanks Kimbo, It's fig harvest season and the wife is in England with her family. 15 hour work days takes it's toll. Now nearing the end. 170 tracks from people I follow that I haven't heard, and am not likely to. Kind of you to notice I've been absent. All OK.
Edited by Wade on April 19 2018 03:12
posted on #14
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"music widow" It played a big part of why I am divorced. I didn't have enough time for her. She found someone who did. To me music is the only real magic left in the world besides love. It's a shame that sometimes you have to choose one or the other. In my case I wasn't given a that opportunity and it cost the person I thought I'd spend the rest of my life with. As well as most of what I owned. I've had to start over from scratch. I still make music....but if I could go back in time. I would have chosen her and hung my guitar on the wall where I could at least see it, and dream of the music that we'd make. It was not to be. So now I dream of what could have been. Sorry to be so down about this subject. But it hits home for me...literally.
posted on #15
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@ Acousticeg That truly touch's me Love lost I think never goes away. But you should not be to hard on yourself for your love of music. at 30 I had my son the wife told me it was time to hang up the guitar, I did for 20 years until she left me for a married man. I had done what she asked still lost her and lost 20 years of my other love
posted on #16
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Oh my this thread is so interesting, uplifting and heartbreaking all at once! My story is that when I met my ex, he met my then guitarist who was very handsome and talented. My partner did not like the attention I got from music and so I only played when he wasnt home hence my description I mentioned earlier that music was a dirty little secret I kept for ten years. It was actually the support I found on Wikiloops that made me realize I couldnt carry on like that and so I chose music over love but hey you know what? That wasnt really love. My guitar never let me down and it has been very tough starting over but music lifts me everyday and I am very grateful for Wikiloops and my friends here.
posted on #17
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what can be said ...People are F'd up generally speaking...they(we) need help! It is a losing proposition if you base your life on people(or your own F'd up-ness) and not on, what is not F'd up! Yes Tu, it is heartbreaking, yet uplifting at the same time. A double edge on that sword. Thanks for the Posting!
posted on #18
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Gemmy is so in tune with the F'd upness that it comes out all profound and S't :D
posted on #19
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Hummm, je pensais que c'était un travers typiquement français, mais je vois que non, même si en France c'est plus fort qu'ailleurs
Hmmm, I thought it was a typical French way, but I see no, even if in France it's stronger than elsewhere
Les artistes, les CREATEURS ont toujours eu des difficultés avec leur entourage
Artists, CREATORS have always had difficulties with those around them
Arthur Rimbaud, sa mère et sa soeur voulait qu'il soit un bon poête chrétien . . . mais Soleil et Chair dit tout autres chose
Arthur Rimbaud, his mother and sister wanted him to be a good Christian poet. . . but Sun and Flesh says everything else
Théo Van Gogh n'a jamais cru au talent de son frère Vincent
Theo Van Gogh never believed in the talent of his brother Vincent.
Les gens préfèrent voir et entendre des choses qu'ils connaissent, qu'ils ont déja vues et entendues; Ca les rassurent. Les créateurs les effraient.
People prefer to see and hear things they know, that they have already seen and heard; It reassures them. The creators frighten them.
Un proverbe francais dit: Nul n'est prophète en son pays.
A French proverb says: No one is a prophet in his country.
Cela veut dire qu'il ne faut attendre de reconnaissance des siens mais il faut aller ailleurs
This means that we must wait for recognition from his family but we must go elsewhere.
Je pense que tu as trouvé reconnaissance sur WIKILOOPS !
I think you found recognition on WIKILOOPS!
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