feature request - adding tracks from other stems and attributing credit

there are occasions where drums may be borrowed from another track, or some other instrument, it is then added to a different template/stem. sure the composer can add 'thanks' in the description and give credit, etc, but there is no 'notification' at all. let's say when selecting an instrument from the drop-down list, would be cool if there was say a checkbox for "provided by", then a search box would enable and you could select the person who provided the drum template, vox template, etc. this would trigger them to be included in the remix notification/email. currently, borrowing from other templates doesn't email notify or dashboard notify the person that their instrument was used in a remix and may go completely unnoticed.

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I hear ya,
and yes, that would be a nice-to-have. I believe I have referred to the described scenario as "cross-branch-remixes" in the past.

I see it like this:
This is another rather sophisticated feature, ust image what the upload form would need to look like:
You'd basically need a set of fields where you would be able to enter combinations of
Drums -> taken from track #312
Guitar -> taken from #1234
Triangle -> added myself

You really need to be a wikiloops nerd to understand what you are supposed to do with that interface, so I would definitly hide that from sight if you do not explicitly request to define a cross-branch-mix.
Now, it is even trickier: with single tracks available, you would actually need to be able to specify if you used only the guitar single track from #1234, or the mixed track of #1234, which might include kazoo from a previous step... this is really quite complicated, because we'd ideally want to inform the kazoo player, too, then.

One could notify people as you'd expect if that information was stated, but then there still is the issue with the remix tree display, which simply cannot cover the situation of a cross-branch-mix visually.
The standard tree wont work, so that must be hidden on those tracks.
Maybe one could just display a simplified visualisation showing only the current track, and the used ingredient-tracks, without revealing much of their standard-tree-siblings (this is complicated to describe in words, a bad sign :) ).
It would need to look something like the attached image, and that is likely to become quite wild, visually.

If you have read this post and feel like "wow, I dont even get what the hell they are talking about", then that is why the issue has not been solved, it is complicated. Not saying I wont solve it one day :)

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Dick attached the following image:

Some people send private messages when they use someone's contribution on a track. Instead of taking a minute to do this, perhaps it could be done in a few seconds...

IF ... wikiloops pages are aware of the context and will vary certain actions depending on the context...

If so, when in the context of a template submission, could there be a "zing" feature - kind of like a ping - where the author could type in the name of the person they want to inform regarding using their contribution, and this would send a simple message such as "You have been zinged from #987654".

In other words, this is a simplified private message just for this purpose. But perhaps this is even more complicated! :|

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Generally a good approach to solving the "how do people get informed their track has been remixed, but the remix is not available as a standard remix to their track" - it can be done by PM as you stated, it can alternatively be done by comment on the track as well, thus informing the remixed member AND people potentially interested in that remix.

The issue I see with the "zing" feature is this:
If you can "zing" anyone on your upload by selecting usernames, this might be abused to attract certain people to check out my upload. Think of popular singers on the loops, they might get zinged on every second upload, and that would be annoying really quickly.
If you need to enter the tracks Id to "zing", then we are already half the way into the complicated declaration I sketched in my previous post.
If there was just the headline "zing some folks by entering track IDs", nobody would understand what the purpose of that tool is... and features that need a world of explanation tend to be neglected from my experience.

I'd rather solve the cross-branch-mix in a clear straightforward way. I believe it was zedders who reminded us of "people on the loops can handle complicated DAWs, don't think they were incapable of handling complicated things", which is very true. It just needs proper distinguishing of the cases "standard remix" and "cross branch remix", with somehow self-explanatory wordings. It can be done, it will be rarely used by some hardcore users, but half-hearted approaches will only cause more confusion I'm afraid.

This is a long-term toDo, I'd rather make sure the single track attaching work even better, maybe allowing for more than one attached single track per upload, which would be a great quality improvement IMO. And one that might be beneficial to more users, so, take that as one example of things I feel are more deserving at this time.

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I meant: have a text box near the Submit button with instructions such as:
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If there is a contributor to this upload you would like to inform, enter their username here.
NB: this is intended only for users whose previous musical contribution (or some part of it) has been used within this track. Please do not abuse.
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As previously suggested, the context (ie track ID) would be picked up by the software so the uploader would only need to type in the username. Upon Submit, the software would run through its routine which would now include a message to the username in the text box.

So it would be quite clear and straightforward, there would be no list of usernames to select from (unless that's easy for you to do), and no track ID (which is only presented after submission anyway) to type in. It would be an addition the present usage of mentioning the contributing user in the description, but with added notification.

The contributing musician would see the track ID in the message, click on it, and happily discover the part they played.

There is scope for abuse I suppose and perhaps you're right about this being only a half-hearted solution, but I hope I've clarified my suggestion so it makes more sense. Being totally clear with wording is very difficult! Well done for your wording in wikiloops, you've done a great job especially as English is not your native language.

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maybe it could be a member feature , like a Gold Member feature where you can mix 8 levels deep. seems like more thoroughly involved members might be extending tracks deeper than the 6 stems...just a thought on a possible solution to the 6 stem deep max.

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I do like the creative exchange we are having here :)
From my experience, it'd have to be a selectbox or autocompleted input, otherwise typos in the freely entered usernames will quickly spoil the fun.
Not entering the track ID of the used track (not the current uploads, mind) leads to a situation where "the software" (I never think of wikiloops as a software tbh) might determine whom to notify about which newly added track,
but without knowing which of the recipients tracks was actually included.
That's no good, think I snatched your hd vocals and cross-mixed them into my track.
Whoever hears my track and wants to know about where to spot those vocals... can only be taken to your profile + good luck... hmmm.
That seems nowhere near the "quality" of the normal remix navigation options without the right track ID to hop to.
Sorry for being negative on this approach, but once I start to think about the abuse potential... nobody really wants to monitor that if it is abused - and the whole input field leaves a lot of room for interpretation: Someone will think: "oh, this is where I reference the parts I stole off of spotify" and enter names of non-wl-artists, someone else will quit worrying about track IDs and remix placements and just upload everything as a template, and just reference the others by name via that convenient box... way too much room for user misunderstandings there IMO, sorry to say :)



Thank you for saying that, it is something that I never feel sure about, so, feel free to point me at any really bad mess-ups I may be guilty of.
I also thank you for adding your own pitch on how that might be worded, Getting such short-spaced explanatory messages right is really difficult, and I appreciate your taking the challenge very much, seriously.



Now, that is a different feature suggestion of its own my friend :)

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Thanks for taking the time to respond, Dick. I've now realised we're coming at this from different angles! I should have clarified that previously.

I'm thinking ONLY about notifying contributing users and NOT AT ALL about letting the world know via the track page. I thought that was rootshell's original intention but perhaps I'm mistaken? I saw your first reply to rootshell as something much deeper to do at a much later date, and I wasn't responding to that but instead responding to the notification of contributors part.

Your code already notifies some contributors that a track has been added or remixed, but misses some contributors, as rootshell describes. My input field idea, therefore, is to enable the uploader to notify the missing contributor(s), by entering/selecting their username(s) there. Your code would pick this up from the upload page and add them to the others already being notified. AND THAT IS ALL!

If you still feel my idea is open to too much abuse and, therefore, making the complicated changes you've hinted at will be necessary to prevent that and do the job properly, then I support you all the way. You're the man and know better than any of us what is needed and what can and cannot be done safely that benefits all. I hope this is my last post in this thread! Thanks for your patience!

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