It's More Than Music Here
Just a random thought :)
Everyone is happy to help. In the end we create something good and enjoyable. The world should take note of what has been accomplished here on the loops. It would be a better place to live...
Johnv: I try to address your concerns in my every upload. Many have commented on my upload descriptions as being a useful insight into my creative process and they seem to enjoy them so I continue with them, wordy though they are (and I often hit the character limit!). But, in fairness, I'm a native English speaker (WL's, I guess, 'default' language) so find it easy. I can imagine non-English speakers may struggle through fear of translations not being right!
My profile contains all the details of the equipment I use to record. Like you, I'd love to read more about how people approached the music in the descriptions. I've also done forum threads on how I process it all. Maybe I'm just too much of a nerd!
I'm often in awe of the technical wizardry of member's recording and mixing, yet my eyes glaze over when the discussion is too technical. It must be wonderful to have that knowledge. I'm just glad if I can play something that works musically. Fortunately this site does not demand a high level of sound engineering and most are primarily listening to the music.
It's hard to know when receiving comments like "cool, fab, killer, etc." whether this is a genuine comment by someone who has actually listened to the track, or an ingenuous (facebook style) social bit of back-slapping. We are all pressed in our lives for time, with few of us able to listen fully to all the tracks of those we "follow", much less newcomer's offerings.
Hard to know what the future is for wikiloops and its members. With increasing numbers of members and tracks it may be that we divide ourselves into socio-musical groups that keep us from overload. These sorts of social dynamics are predictable, but were probably not foreseen. Hopefully all will still works as segments within a larger framework, although it may seem a less friendly place to newcomers who aren't part of one of the existing socio-musical circles.
Well, that's more than enough from me!
Edited by Wade on 11-02-2016 22:22
I'd hate to see the loops break up into groups (I guess the private bands feature is sort of that) or, as you so eloquently put, socio-musical groupings and will fight any addition of such features. This will lead to a perception of elitism or cliques to newcomers, I feel. It happens on forums, it happens everywhere. WL is open to all - it is no more judgemental of ability than it is of your origins, it must stay that way even if we can't keep up with the flow!
I've considered for while stopping adding to tracks (apart from the odd one which really grabs my attention) and just doing templates. That way, provide the help for others rather than just indulge my musical musings. There certainly seems to be a never-ending appetite for good quality drum templates and it would be selfish of me not to oblige.
Edited by mpointon on 15-02-2016 10:46
It was great interest to read this topic posts...
"It's more than music here..."
Just like Wade, I'm not involved in any kind of social network except here at WL.
But I do not consider that WL is a social network like others.
From my experience or feeling it's an interactive tool which enables musicians to practise, improve and play.
But most of all, here, we do produce something. We share what we make with the help of others. We bring our sensibility, skills and feelings.
It's both a personal and a common achievement from playing. It enables me pleasure when playing at a point I couldn't reach if playing alone.
I've red what Wade said around a kind of fear about "socio-musical circles" and the fact it could lead to a less friendly place to new comers.
I'm a new comer... And I've well noticed when discovering WL that musical affinities create some kind of groups. As martin said "it happens everywhere..."
Talking about musicians level. I always remind that music, in my opinion is a great everyday humbling experience. I've had a 16 years break with playing and some musicians level and diversity are highly motivating and stimulating me if I want to recover and improve my play, join and try to bring a part of my creativity to others.
The musician part of my being woke up one year ago. And I've tried to join local bands.
I have to confess that I can't cope anymore with what I experimented when playing with bands younger. Some adults are stuck in an ego dimension around the fact of playing even (I would say mainly in fact...) when poor players.
Real life playing is not really a friendly place for new comers...
I just want to play, have some fun, express myself and share feelings when playing.
Hard to find a perfect combination of musical and human affinities.
We do not have that kind of problem at WL.
About the "comments" or "making comments" part: It's some way kind a "Care Bears" universe.
It is not a constructive process, but as Rickplayer said, it's positive. WL is a community of caring musicians.
Thanks again to the loopers who have posted some comments around my tracks ^^
So... I have no real hindsight around my WL experience so far, this is just a testimony from a new comer.
Music making is a personnal process, but it is pointless or has no meaning if not shared.
Whatever how it is shared. That's why in my opinion, "here it's more than music..."
Edited by Funkystan on 15-02-2016 16:06
Edited by DannyK on 15-02-2016 17:44
I'd also like to take some negative but constructive comments.
Let's ask the WL developers how this idea could be set up...
You could always message a person if you want to share constructive negative comments. This way it will be between you and that person and not everyone on Wikiloops to see.
I understand the pros and cons of the constructive criticism matter though, whatever is the standard here I will adhere to.
All in all this is a great great place, and you meet some amazing people and musicians here, that's for sure!
"...but as it stands there won't be any criticism allowed..."
this is not true, there is no such statement on wikiloops as "criticism is not allowed", I don't know where you got that from tbh.
There are two things that have been done on wikiloops to preserve the praised positive spirit of this platform:
I re-labeled the "post comment" button to "post compliment" for the fun of it,
and we have been calling people to order who have shown a tendency of leaving non-constructive bashing comments. That's all.
If you want honest feedback on some aspect of your recordings (say, sound), I'd recommend saying so in your tracks description. Showing interest in criticism is a good way to let people know you are actually after tips on what to improve.
Please never forget this is a multi-cultural environment here, so taking your own view on criticism as "normal" may not apply here- which is why diplomatic care and well-chosen words are recommended. You would not want to find out someone was deeply offended and left the cmmunity just because of something you said, thinking it would improve the guys playing.
Giving constructive criticism in a foreign language can easily go wrong, too, I have had to moderate several cases where google translate turned a witty thought into an offensive onslaught... which leaves me thankfull if people avoid this.
"It's more than music here" is the title of this thread, and I'd like to thank those who expressed their feelings and perceptions above.
From my personal point of view, it is a lot more than music here, with all the technical details and the social & educational experience happening. You may observe various phenomenons and go off to quite abstract thoughts about "what is this thing wikiloops", and I would like to add that -to me-, the social behaviour of the sum of individuals using wikiloops has more impact on what it "is" than what I could have done on the programmatic level :)
Edited by Dick on 16-02-2016 11:23
yes, you are looking at the administrators signature.
"I prefer to be told... what and how to improve..."
I guess this would suppose a willing to be constructively critized and helped. Short comments are not that helpful as far as they don't concretely show what the suggestion would be.
We also have to consider that words are very importants and here we are talking about members coming from 146 countries. I'm French and I allways have to think on what I'm writting in order to avoid a "qui proquo" or a misunderstanding translation.
If there was a Wikiloops section called "Help me and show me..." I would be the first one to upload a track.
Here at Wiki, we have a great "sharing ideas tool", we could upload/download a track and ask for/add suggestions playing on beside (or cutting some parts)to the one who requires it.
I've learned how to play by myself and I've never had a teacher, it could have been useful and I guess it still can be.
I was thinking on the best way to express myself about what TG_strat has written when Dick posted his comment. I haven't seen it before I posted mine. Seems like he has said things better than I could do.
Yes Nilton, I guess new ideas are blooming from this thread... ;-)
Edited by Funkystan on 16-02-2016 13:35
"This place is such an awesome place to meet folks and jam with them on some amazing creations! Before this, it was mostly all about finding a backing track to jam with, but this is so much more personal!! Awesome site and just love the potential here"